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Motor heats up, power is cut
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87IrocTim
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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2006 9:15 pm    Post subject: Motor heats up, power is cut Reply with quote

Well i finally got my maro insured and ive been studying how the motors been runing and all. basically it runs beautiful, and has no odd exhaust smoke or anything like that. well, it seems that after the motor gets around 160-180 degrees, the power is cut noticably. throttle response is not deminished, but the rpms take longer to climb, and it even has trouble spinning out in first gear. but, when its below those temperatures, the rpm's climb very fast, and it burns out in 2nd gear let alone 1st. the heat riser ports on my manifold are not blocked off, and the manifold gets very hot, like could boil an egg. would blocking the heat riser ports solve my problem? it just gets soggy when it heats up jsut under 200, although it runs smooth all the time. and, would a fuel cooler further help the situation.
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af2
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1933 Willys Coupe

PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2006 9:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

With the Edelbrock Carb you could be boiling the fuel. I have had that happen more than once. I know you have no room to run a phenolic spacer so you have to control the heat to the carb. Blocking the heat riser will help a bunch. Without seeing the situation it is an educated guess.
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Aerosmith
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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2006 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

like af2 said you need a plate. I started off with an edelbrock one. It's basically a 1/4" carb gasket with plastic grommets for the studs. The edelbrock carb is like alum so it soaks the heat up, drive it to full temp and pop your hood, if it gets too hot to touch listen carefully to it you will probably hear the fuel boiling like I did! to be honest the edelbrick spacer was not enough for me, I was still transferring heat through the carb studs. I ended up going to a 1" phenolic spacer for the summer and a 1" aluminum for the winter(my carb has no choke!). Also, I don't remember if you have headers or not. If you have factory manifolds, you very well may have a stuck preheater valve like I had. It is located in the passenger side at the end of the exhaust manifold where the y-pipe bolts up. Mine was stuck about 25% open so I was only getting about 60% of the power the engine was making. I took off the valve and cut the butterfly out of it and put it back on.
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87IrocTim
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 1:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yea i actually do have headers. i did infact let it heat up and listen and the fuel was actually boiling in the carb. i mean the manifold really does get hot enough to boil an egg, i burnt myself a few times now. i really dont have room for a spacer, so im going to try to do everything i can to get around it. ill block the heat risers and maybe even grab a cheap fuel cooler for 40 bucks. ill get back to you soon thanks. tim
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Aerosmith
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What manifold are you running? It looks like a single plane in the pic. If so it could really hurt you down low.
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87IrocTim
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yea it is a single plane, and it does noticeably hurt down low. i have pretty crummy bottom end but when the motor heats up, the intire powerband is hurt. its a huge difference from start-up to 180 degrees. like i said before when its cold, around 110-140, it will have no problem burnin into second gear, but when it gets to 180-200, it has trouble even breaking traction in first. and when i free rev it quick, it takes a lot longer for the rpm's to climb, even off idle. by the way that single plane was not jsut thrown on there, its matched almost exactly to my cam.
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af2
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Get the boiling problem issue solved and you will like it. You are going to aluminum heads an they will have that POS riser shut off . Adam
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87IrocTim
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yea thank god half my problems would be solved by aluminum heads
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artinla
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PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A couple other things you might try..

You said a spacer was out of the question, so how about double gaskets with a piece of aluminum in between? Leave about 3 inches hang out in front of the carb and bend it down at a 45 degree angle to allow air to flow across it.

Another possibility is to fashion a cool air box around your air cleaner and use flexible hose to duct air from somewhere other than behind the radiator. On many cars, the area near the headlights is a good place to draw from.

It is easy to make a low buck fuel cooler with a plastic coffee can and a few feet of copper tubing. You can add ice to that but be careful to re-jet your carb when you use ice. Another option is to use an oil cooler in front of the radiator to cool your fuel.

Your carb studs can transfer a lot of heat into your carb. Use insulators under the nuts.

The camaro and firebirds retain a lot of heat under the hood. You might want to see if your air dam is intact. Many times they get damaged or are completely missing. You should replace it if it is missing. It is critical for getting air to flow through the engine compartment. Also, if you have a seal at the cowl under the rear of the hood, remove it. That Bra is probably hurting your airflow as well.

Lastly, I think (Don't hold me to this) that you are supposed to block at least one of the heat riser passages when using that type of intake. Check on that, you probably could get away with blocking them both. I would try it anyway.

Good luck.
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af2
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1933 Willys Coupe

PostPosted: Mon May 22, 2006 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="artinlour

Lastly, I think (Don't hold me to this) that you are supposed to block at least one of the heat riser passages when using that type of intake. Check on that, you probably could get away with blocking them both. I would try it anyway.

Good luck.[/quote]

How about both????
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87IrocTim
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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i actually bought gaskets 2day, and will be throwing them on tomorro. thanks for the suggestions, if it still acts up after the risers are blocked, then ill give that gasket idea a try. thanks.
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Aerosmith
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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Normally the rear hood seal would be a god suggestion, bowever..Like you I have t-tops on my Camaro, and if you ever want to take them out don't take off the rear hood seal. All the heat from under your hood comes right into the car..along with any fumes.
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Aerosmith
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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You know I hate to say it but I think you are going to have to bite the bullet and either get a larger diameter lower profile filter and a insulator plate, put on a lower profile dual plane manifold(or a low profile single plane like the Weiand xcelerator) or invest in a hood that will give you clearance to keep what you have(you can keep the stock hood to put back on later). You can have all the motor in the world and if you can't let it breath and stay cool it will do no good other than at a car show(god knows there are tons of those cars around!). I like the sleeper approach, but look what you're sacrificing.
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87IrocTim
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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i know its killin me too, as for the intake, im on a last ditch effort here, and im actually making an air cleaner. ill post pictures of its progress soon, but basically, it has the edelbrock pro flo 1000 base, but has 2 inch metal side that i bent and welded it in, and im going to weld a metal top to it. then im going to cut two oval holes in the to front flat spots, and run two 3inch pipes slightly angled down, no longer then 4 inches, and stick two cone filters on it. im not exactly sure how this is going to look, but it should be able to breathe and fit easy also. ill take a picture of its progress so far. inspiration courtesy of american hotrod on tv lastnight.
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87IrocTim
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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2006 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote





im nto sure how this is going to look, but i am going to be painting it. so far i welded the sides on it, and shortened the neck that sits on the carb. i still have to weld a top to it cut to the same shape. as for the holes im cutting in the two fornt sides, im going to take two 3 inch exhaust tubing pieces about 5 inches long, and smush jsut one end of each pipe into an oval, one pipe fore each side. i will then cut out an equaly sized oval fron the side of the air cleaner, and weld the tubes to it. i will slightly bend the tubes so they both face down a little, and stick two cheap cone filters on the ends. also will be painting it jsut so it doesnt look too trashy. once thats done, ill have plenty of time to figure out how im going to set up something really nice for it. my old man was talking about making a tray, that a flat k&n filter sits on top of it, and has little clips on each side to hold it down. along wiht that, we would be cutting out a small portion of metal from under the black louvers so air can get through. the only catch to this is fair weather only, which we are currently thinking about solving also.

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