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New 408
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Paul P
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Joined: 15 Aug 2002
Posts: 2404
Location: Townsend, Mass.
81616.60 points


1971 Chevrolet Chevelle

PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 11:52 pm    Post subject: New 408 Reply with quote

Good news. The cam bearing journal in the block is not damaged. Good thing I was only going 10 mph when it spun. The engine is up at the shop in Hudson that Jeep and I use. I'll be going 4.160 over and putting some new pistons in it. Right now it looks like it will only cost me 575 to get the block cleaned,crank center line honed and all 8 holes honed out to 4.160 or what ever minimal amount cleans it up to save the block.

Not sure what pistions will cost but looks like 100 a hole basically.

Then on to the Dart 17s that will get finished up port wise as they were stalling at .600 lift at 308cfm should be more in them if that is fixed.

Only issue is my Pro-jection might have to go as it is not capable of feeding the new setup. Sad

I'll post more later with pics as things come along.

_________________
2001 Focus 2.0 Zetec
stock cams, bolt-ons and tune
15.63@87 MPH 1/4mi

1971 - Chevelle 408 SBC N/A
6.86@102.5 MPH 1/8mi
10.78@122 MPH 1/4mi


Last edited by Paul P on Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:38 am; edited 3 times in total
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af2
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Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 5558
Location: grassvalley, ca
71227.76 points


1933 Willys Coupe

PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 12:46 am    Post subject: Re: Spun cam bearing in 406 Reply with quote

Paul P wrote:
Good news. The cam bearing journal in the block is not damaged.


OK
Why did it spin?
Sounds like not enough interference fit?
Or a cam that had too much journal size?

Just thinking. Confused
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SMOKEmUP
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Joined: 30 May 2002
Posts: 3169

65097.54 points


1979 Chevrolet Camaro

PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's good news. Tell Chad from the machine shop I said hi.
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10sec.et
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Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 3473
Location: Houston,Texas
346658.74 points


1969 Oldsmobile Cutlass

PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 2:32 am    Post subject: Re: Spun cam bearing in 406 Reply with quote

af2 wrote:
Paul P wrote:
Good news. The cam bearing journal in the block is not damaged.


OK
Why did it spin?
Sounds like not enough interference fit?
Or a cam that had too much journal size?

Just thinking. Confused


i had to polish the surface of the front cam bearing in my block to get the cam to turn smoothly. looked like the bearing just had a weird uneven surface. im sure if i hadnt cleaned it up it would have spun later on. fortunately mine was right out front. dont know how you would tell if you had a screwed up cam bearing further in.

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af2 wrote:
It seems we can look at our magical Balls and come up with a fix?

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clay
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Joined: 24 Nov 2002
Posts: 3209
Location: South Carolina
318129.23 points


1972 Chevrolet Nova

PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good news. Sounds like some evilness in the making Twisted Evil . I haven't heard of a cam bearing spinning before. This engine has been together for a while right? Things like this that happen on a new build are one thing, but when they happen on one that has been together a while, it puzzles me. Clay
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Paul P
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Joined: 15 Aug 2002
Posts: 2404
Location: Townsend, Mass.
81616.60 points


1971 Chevrolet Chevelle

PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Spun cam bearing in 406 Reply with quote

af2 wrote:
Paul P wrote:
Good news. The cam bearing journal in the block is not damaged.


OK
Why did it spin?
Sounds like not enough interference fit?
Or a cam that had too much journal size?

Just thinking. Confused


I was told likely journal to tight but I believe there was a bit of not enough interference fit as well.

One of my theories is I just changed engine oil to Mobil 1 15w-50 full synthetic Racing formula. Not sure if the lack of ZDDP was the culprit. Kind of a back of my mind thing. Oil pressure was better and more stable than with other oils. It was slippery enough to save the block so I don't know what to think.

It is puzzling. confused

_________________
2001 Focus 2.0 Zetec
stock cams, bolt-ons and tune
15.63@87 MPH 1/4mi

1971 - Chevelle 408 SBC N/A
6.86@102.5 MPH 1/8mi
10.78@122 MPH 1/4mi
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af2
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Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 5558
Location: grassvalley, ca
71227.76 points


1933 Willys Coupe

PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 6:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Spun cam bearing in 406 Reply with quote

Paul P wrote:
af2 wrote:


OK
Why did it spin?
Sounds like not enough interference fit?
Or a cam that had too much journal size?

Just thinking. Confused

One of my theories is I just changed engine oil to Mobil 1 15w-50 full synthetic Racing formula. Not sure if the lack of ZDDP was the culprit. Kind of a back of my mind thing.


Paul that lack of ZDDP is the main reason I won't run synthetic in anything I own.

Everyone has made the arguments and will till we run electric.

My point is the ZDDP will give the 'cushion' if clearances are tight. As in no metal contact.


Kind of crazy how you just changed oil and cam hits the fan.
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10sec.et
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Joined: 29 Mar 2006
Posts: 3473
Location: Houston,Texas
346658.74 points


1969 Oldsmobile Cutlass

PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

why run 50 wt oil ? i saw a 20 increase in oil temp just by going from 10w30 to 10w40. im seriously considering 5w30 for the new engine.

as far as ZDDP, i dont see where the newer oils would have an effect on cam bearings. lobes maybe if its flat tappet but if it has proper clearance i just dont see it taking out the bearings. i run Mobil 1 in my LT1 (as it has for most of its life). it has 179K on the clock and still runs strong. i do agree with Adam about tight clearances needing better lubrication but if it wasnt too tight to begin with......

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af2 wrote:
It seems we can look at our magical Balls and come up with a fix?

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jeep_406
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Joined: 12 Sep 2002
Posts: 1661
Location: Tewksbury, Mass 01876
53123.48 points


1972 Chevrolet Nova

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paul,
Ask Paul Rinaldi about oil. At Golen's, they now use Joe Gibbs oil when dynoing engines. They've found a lot less metal when they cut open the oil filters after break in.
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Skunkworkx
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Joined: 02 Sep 2007
Posts: 352
Location: Harford Co. Maryland
10318.16 points


1968 Chevrolet Camaro

PostPosted: Sun Dec 05, 2010 9:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Funny you bring up the oil change and spun bearing.

I changed to a synthetic blend...no sounds,knocks,squeals,nothing Confused Changing cam a few weeks later and found metal (bronze looking) in lifter valley...thought it was from the valve guides. nope Sad
Ended up pulling motor,found #1 and#2 mains gone,crank scored.

No more syn. oils for me Rolling Eyes

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Paul P
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Joined: 15 Aug 2002
Posts: 2404
Location: Townsend, Mass.
81616.60 points


1971 Chevrolet Chevelle

PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Site is kind of quite these days what's up with that?

Update for ya.

I got the Dart 17 heads and Intake back from HRD. These guys do top notch work for many of the best out there including all the big names in Nascar and more. They out flow my old Dart Sportsmans at .400 lift and flow 310cfm and more from .500 lift up. I have another cam coming from Tim at Bullet Cams. These heads should put me in the mid 600's HP wise easily.

They did some of the best work I have seen no BS. Can't wait to see what this will do on the track.

Paul

_________________
2001 Focus 2.0 Zetec
stock cams, bolt-ons and tune
15.63@87 MPH 1/4mi

1971 - Chevelle 408 SBC N/A
6.86@102.5 MPH 1/8mi
10.78@122 MPH 1/4mi
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William Jones
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Joined: 30 Jan 2006
Posts: 823
Location: Lake city, FL
28541.86 points


1971 Ford Mustang

PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 1:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thats great news Paul I hope she runs like a scalled dog when she done.

Bam

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jeep_406
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1972 Chevrolet Nova

PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 2:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paul, Have you decided on what you're going to use for a piston?
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Paul P
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Joined: 15 Aug 2002
Posts: 2404
Location: Townsend, Mass.
81616.60 points


1971 Chevrolet Chevelle

PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cam was first thing needed according to Paul Rinaldi. Piston will likely be a flat top from Diamond. Chambers are at 60cc's. I am lucky that the cam that I selected with Tim's help at Bullet cams with .690" lift is right for the 934 Pacaloy springs I bought for these heads. The springs are over $300. Should be impressive gains compared to the old setup.
_________________
2001 Focus 2.0 Zetec
stock cams, bolt-ons and tune
15.63@87 MPH 1/4mi

1971 - Chevelle 408 SBC N/A
6.86@102.5 MPH 1/8mi
10.78@122 MPH 1/4mi
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squeeezer
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Joined: 02 Mar 2007
Posts: 2427
Location: new richmond WI
191524.76 points


1991 Chevrolet Camaro

PostPosted: Fri Feb 25, 2011 6:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

whats that gonna run 12 o 1 static
what size cam you gonna run duration wise?
and what fuel do you run?

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