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351c valve spring suggestions??

 
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generis
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Joined: 21 Jun 2006
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1993 Ford Ranger

PostPosted: Fri Jan 26, 2007 11:18 am    Post subject: 351c valve spring suggestions?? Reply with quote

I need to replace my tired springs. I have a 2v head with mild build and want a long lasting good quality spring for a mild cam and stock hardware. Any suggestions??
Thanks

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Big Dave
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 26, 2007 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My suggestion is contact the manufacturer (grinder) of your cam for their recommendation and select quality springs and retainers that most closely match their recommendation of:

Installed height,
Seat pressure,
Open load,
Max lift before coil bind.

Keep in mind Dual springs are better than Singles, and Triples are for racing only. That you will need a hardened spring cup (OD or ID) if running on an aluminum head and to file the damper edges and corners smooth (top and bottom), and to wash the springs before installing them.

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PORTWORX PERFORMANCE
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2007 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

depending on the mild build up you have .erson make a spring that a single spring that good up to .550 lift at 1.800 installed height
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squeeezer
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1991 Chevrolet Camaro

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

how bout beehives
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af2
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1933 Willys Coupe

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

squeeezer wrote:
how bout beehives


Behives are not the answer and never have been!
Ask Paul and see even a stock motor See's harmonics that destroy parts!

A good dual spring is most advisable because they cost more to make and work good to a certain extent. I don't care if the spring is ovulate it still See's harmonics that kill them!
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squeeezer
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1991 Chevrolet Camaro

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

af2 wrote:
squeeezer wrote:
how bout beehives


Behives are not the answer and never have been!
Ask Paul and see even a stock motor See's harmonics that destroy parts!

A good dual spring is most advisable because they cost more to make and work good to a certain extent. I don't care if the spring is ovulate it still See's harmonics that kill them!





ive always used dual springs in an application that requires them
but.....ive always liked to try the beehives
lets not forget the lsx engines come with them from the factory as well as other engines
im sure there is a point of no return (performance wise) like in your case 8500rpm ......hell no im not using beehives...no one makes one with enough pressure
bottom line is i go with what the cam manufacturer suggests or a little above and beyond for instance a spring with a little more rate than whats suggested by the manufacturer

magazines aside they are proven performers for mild to wild combos 400 to 600hp level in small blocks

lightening the retainer weight+ adding more rpm as an end result
i only bring up the lsx engines due to the fact that they are proven for longevity as well as 3100 and 3400 and 3800 engines
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af2
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1933 Willys Coupe

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="squeeezer"]
af2 wrote:





ive always used dual springs in an application


I can't agree more! Very Happy
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squeeezer
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 11:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing you funny guy

guess your not buyin huh

maybe some day (DEPENDING ON THE APPLICATION) ill form my own oppinion on beehives
till then its double springs
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wagon train
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1983 Mercury Capri

PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have used Beehive springs.In a class car I built.I was able to rev the engine about 500 rpm higher and still make power.NMRA Real Street class car.Top 5 qualifier and several race wins.It was proven on the dyno and the track.If you are unable to increase spring pressure,then making it lighter will have the same effect.
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af2
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2007 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Comp behives were made by PAC until recently and had very few problems. The are now made I believe in Brazil and are having breakage problems quite often.
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Big Dave
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One reason we "old" guys resist change is because we have experience.

My experience tells me when a single spring breaks there is nothing to keep the valve from dropping. When the valve drops there is nothing to prevent it from coming in contact with the piston at the most inopportune time. When that happens the valve is broken off destroying the guide, it then gets rammed up into the head destroying the cylinder head, by burying the valve head in the piston it destroys the piston. The forces involved in doing this damage then can bend the crank and the rods, if they bend too much they break and take out the block.

In over forty years of building motors for abuse I have lost only two too a bottom end failure, but I have destroyed two L-88's and one LS-7 three other less expensive 454's and two other 427's as well as six 396 motors when learning how to play, all because a valve spring broke. I tend to obsess over the valve springs, and valve train components.

Now I recognize reducing any mass on the valve train is important. I also know that Ferrea makes nice sodium filled hollow stem stainless steel intake valves ( I still use Manley solid stainless steel exhaust valves). CompCams makes nice titanium valve retainers that are only four times more expensive and last one fourth the time. I also know that a rev kit will take some of the load of a roller cam tappet off of the valve spring so that it can do it's job of controlling only the valve, and my heavier than the stock stamped steel rocker arm that much better. I choose to run a chromemoly steel roller rocker over an aluminum one because aluminum work hardens and breaks without warning. (I have broken three aluminum ones so far).

I also recognize that the beehive will self dampen spring harmonics. Running a big block with the valve set at multiple angles from the plane of rotation of the rocker I am all to familiar with spring harmonics. I choose to address this problem with triple wound springs rather than a single wound spring and check the pressure at every oil change or 250 hours of operation (How many of you guys run an hour meter beside your tach and oil pressure gauge? Mine came off an old lawn tractor.) A spring checker can be purchased for under seventy five dollars and it could save your investment in your motor (I use two different ones, but most can use a Moroso 62390 as it covers most spring pressures and it is easy to use on the car with just enough handle length to compress the spring without getting caught on other car parts like the master cylinder).

When they make a multiple spring Beehive I will try them.


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SMOKEmUP
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm running Comp 918 beehive springs in my LS1, titanium retainers, with hollow valve stems, so far so good.

Initially the Comp 918's had breakage problems. The good springs have a blue stripe on them. This was a while back and haven't heard anything more about quality control issues since they fixed them with the blue stripes.

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af2
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1933 Willys Coupe

PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2007 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The PAC springs have the blue stripe!
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